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Concern over Population Increase on TG Server: Mumble Program

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  • Concern over Population Increase on TG Server: Mumble Program

    Well, we all know that TG has became a popular server for players who are here to have a good game unlike other servers where rascals run around and team kill on the carrier, and so on, so on...

    Since Mumble was released with the 0.9 version of PR, it made TG the second (or first?) compared to RT Mumble most popular when it comes to using this program. Everyday, people are persuaded to use Mumble. Some of them find no reason for it, others find it another important factor to having a great game. And since TG is supporting the use of Mumble, it has so many supporting members that its irritating Mumble users and general players by getting kicked out for supporting members when its called "PUBLIC SERVER".

    Is it possible that TG can open up a "TRUE" Public server?

    I mean, RT Mumble, I would have to say, second because a lot of people do spam on it in their server. Plus it has higher ping and lag (well, TG has been having a lot of lag lately). But I do like the fact that RT Mumble has 1 channel:

    Example: (from RT Mumble, it's hectic, yet very fun. TG rules can fix the immaturity and pride)


    I'm not saying that we should go to that, I just said that to show you these video clips lol. I find some of them funny

    And also, talking to other squads:


    I just wanted to bring this concern up over increasing population (and popularity) due to Mumble and its conflicting with the supporting member issue. Also, what is causing all this lag this past week?

  • #2
    Re: Concern over Population Increase on TG Server: Mumble Program

    i think i missed the part with the question in it but,

    Bodacious conjecture, lad.
    doYouEvenLuftwaffe

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Concern over Population Increase on TG Server: Mumble Program

      I think he's asking for a new server (whether it's a TG mumble server or an actual other PR server I don't know...). I can answer both though: the PR mumble server does a lovely job at the moment and I see no reason for us to get our own, and no we aren't getting another public server.

      I didn't join a squad once and this guy named Nardini took me into the back room and beat me with a sock of oranges.

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      • #4
        Re: Concern over Population Increase on TG Server: Mumble Program

        I'll address a few points here:
        1. TG has always been the most popular PR server. Hell, there have been times in the past when the server literally saw full numbers (that being 62 players) on a constant 24 hour a day basis.
        2. With the exception of a VERY few pre-planned organized scrims, there has never been a recorded time in which the server was at full capacity with supporting members.
        3. Mumble is still a beta, and anyone who uses it on a regular basis can tell you why. There are lots of bugs in the system still, with the largest being people becoming unlinked for various reasons and able to hear everyone in channel like they were on force center.

        Now, with those things in mind, I'll tack on that servers are expensive. If you want to know how expensive it can be, do a search in the SM forum and look at the numbers apophis and others have posted about the operating costs for TG. Put it this way: many tens of thousands of dollars a year. So getting a new server may or may not be financially feasible. Also, the idea of a "true" public server I'm guessing pertains to not having a SM kick or reserved slots. This is something that has been brought up many times in the past and has been shot down every time for one reason: supporting memberships keep the community alive, and as a perk of supporting the community, SM's are granted the right to play on any TG server, any time they wish, at the "playtime" expense of those who cannot or choose not to support the community. It's a pretty fair trade for 8.95 a month.

        Subsequent to that, the server isnt always full. Matter of fact, most of the time, it isnt, as seen in the following picture from gametracker (the numbers on the left side of the graph indicate players on the server):

        So logically, it wouldnt make much sense to open up a second server and divide the population between the two.

        Next, concerning mumble, I understand that you think the single channel idea is a good one, and I understand that you would like to believe that our rules and standards could solve the problems illustrated in your videos. However, as ridiculously awesome as our admin staff is, even they get swamped, and adding to the list of possible problems they could encounter by having a single-channel mumble server would increase the workload tenfold. As much as we all love TG, not everyone who passes through feels the same way, and there are definitely those who would readily exploit faults in mumble to give them access to enemy movements.

        So sure, at some point in the future, getting a second PR server or making modifications to the way mumble is run might be worth investigating. However, at present, there are too many roadblocks, discrepancies or shortcomings with either or both of those ideas to merit such a leap.

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Concern over Population Increase on TG Server: Mumble Program

          He's asking for a server without SM kicks.

          The answer is no; the SM kick system, while imperfect, is the best way to keep the server and the community in money, keeping it stable. It costs somewhere in the range of 400 dollars a month to run the TG server, IIRC. We'd not be able to gather the needed donations if it wasn't for the sm reserved slots.

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          • #6
            Re: Concern over Population Increase on TG Server: Mumble Program

            Do you think with how PR is growing that in the next year or so there might be a second supporting member supported server ?
            I would like to see a TG run server that had more limited maps like all insurgency or vehicle warfare.
            I don't think single channel mumble will ever work.
            You have to be trusted by the people that you lie to,
            So that when they turn their backs on you,
            You'll get the chance to put the knife in.Pink Floyd "Dogs"

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            • #7
              Re: Concern over Population Increase on TG Server: Mumble Program

              Multiple servers = split community = bad

              Why?

              Let me give you an example. Have you ever looked at the teams most nights on the server? Find the team with a few popular Squad Leaders and you'll find a majority of players wearing TG tags or other assorted "Klingons", with the other side generally being comprised of other players, many of whom you've never heard of. Round after round, people tend to flock to the team with the TG tags. This was previously discussed in our "Klingon" thread.

              Anyway, let's extrapolate that across two servers now. Server "A" would soon be full of all of your favorite SLs (who also happen to be SMs) and their legions of "Klingons", leaving Server "B" for everyone else. Can you honestly say that the same level of play would be experienced on Server "B"? Do you honestly think that all of the SMs who enjoy fighting with or against one another every night would willingly split themselves between two servers. with each facing a degraded level of play? How many more admins would we have to add to cover both of these servers. and what kind of schedule would we have to force onto these admins to assure that there is coverage both in-game and on BF2CC for these two servers? Imagine the confusion for people trying to find not only the right Mumble channel (or TS channel) for their team, but also for the right server they're on.

              The list goes on and on, and I haven't touched on the expense part of the argument that Ferris mentioned above. Doubling the current operating expenses to essentially provide a server for those who do not or can not get a supporting membership, placing the financial burden squarely on the back of the current SMs is hardly what I would call fair. Actually, I would call that freeloading.

              There won't be a second PR server. It isn't the right thing to do for the TG community.

              "You milsim guys are ruining the game."

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Concern over Population Increase on TG Server: Mumble Program

                The benifets of having a narrower focus.
                1. increased ability to be the best.
                2. reduced competition
                3. smaller more managable user base
                4. lower operating costs

                The bad thing about this...
                TG has ruined my Project Reality experience on all other servers.
                That's how they get'cha.
                And how they tricked me into paying ;)

                The 189th Infantry Brigade: Taking the 'the' out of psychotherapist since 2010.

                XFire: mrthomasking

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                • #9
                  Re: Concern over Population Increase on TG Server: Mumble Program

                  If TG had 2 PR Servers (one with sm kick and one without) - Scene from the Movie Tommy boy, replace brake pads with SM kicks and one Server.

                  TG Server 1 with SM Kicks:

                  What my associate is trying to say is that, uh, our new brake pads are really cool. You're not even going to believe it. Like, um, let's say you're driving along the road with your family. And you're driving along la li la. And then, all of the sudden there's a truck tire in the middle of the road. And you hit the brakes. Err! Whoa, that was close.
                  TG Server 2 with no SM kicks:

                  Now let's see what happens when you're driving with the 'other guy's' brake pads. You're driving along. You're driving along and all of the sudden the kids are yelling from the backseat, 'I got to go to the bathroom, daddy!', 'Not now, damn it!', truck tire, eeeee, 'I can't stop!'. Help! There's a cliff! Aah! And your family's screaming 'Oh my god, we're burning alive!' 'No! I can't feel my legs!'. In comes the meat wagon. And the medic gets out and says, 'Oh, my god.'. New guy's in the corner puking his guts out. All because... you want to save a couple of extra pennies. To me it doesn't...
                  If a second server were implemented total chaos would end up reigning, the admin team would be spread extremely thin, especially during the prime Euro hours, and in the end the 2nd server would become just as unpopulated with players trying to get on the first server where all SM/veteran PR players/TG Regs, are.

                  I could also forsee what happens on other servers within PR who have 2 servers, you get one server with team play all around, and the other server which sporadic instances of team play but overshadowed by players doing whatever the hell they want not really caring about the rules of the server. - This is just a worse case scenario. Not trying to be pessimistic, but speaking honestly.


                  Fast Forward to about the 1:10 mark:


                  Animation Videos are fun
                  Last edited by Delta*RandyShugart*; 03-01-2010, 02:03 PM.
                  Randy = Ace ! - Warlab
                  Level II Volunteer FireFighter
                  Level I HazMat Technician
                  NYS EMT-B
                  Town of Mamaroneck Fire Dept.

                  sigpic




                  Bring On Project Reality 1.0!!!
                  RSS Feeds:Bamboo | | 9/11 - Never Forget |
                  Apophis - "TG was created to cater to a VERY specific type of gamer rather than trying to appeal to the greater gaming population.
                  Tactical Gamer is not mainstream.
                  We are not trying to attract mainstream gamers."

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                  • #10
                    Re: Concern over Population Increase on TG Server: Mumble Program

                    + rep to Delta for awesome examples *sick and twisted grin*

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Concern over Population Increase on TG Server: Mumble Program

                      I was asking if people thought PR and TG would grow enough to have 2 SM servers, not 1 paid and 1 free.
                      One would have a longer more varied map list and the other would focus on variant type maps.
                      I'm not asking if this is going to happen tomorrow but it seems inevitable that PR and TG will attract more and more supporting members.
                      While the cost to run the server may be a lot the individual membership is not very much and for me it is the best money I have ever spent ( after PR required upgrades to the PC).
                      You have to be trusted by the people that you lie to,
                      So that when they turn their backs on you,
                      You'll get the chance to put the knife in.Pink Floyd "Dogs"

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Concern over Population Increase on TG Server: Mumble Program

                        Like said before, we are already lacking in playerbase. Those rare peaks late at night (afternoon in USA) are exception, while the rest of the day server sits empty. Once we get server 62 24/7, we then just might, but just might consider another one. Even then, I assume new threads named ''join server2,it's full of pubbies'' or ''admins, start playing on server1'', get it ?

                        So even if we do get a playerbase around a clock there will be people complaining about how uneven the teamplay on whatever server is, just like teamstacking.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Concern over Population Increase on TG Server: Mumble Program

                          Only chance for a second server would be if it was placed in Europe. That way the TG Euros could get the server more easily seeded and active when the US is sleeping. But again two servers = split community, costs, admin-coverage etc, so it's not gonna happen. And also, the TG server does keep going 24/7 sometimes still though, but it's starting to get rare these days.



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                          • #14
                            Re: Concern over Population Increase on TG Server: Mumble Program

                            Originally posted by orpal View Post
                            Like said before, we are already lacking in playerbase. Those rare peaks late at night (afternoon in USA) are exception, while the rest of the day server sits empty.
                            1) We're usually at 62/64 from sometimes 2pm EST to 12am EST on weekends. That's a solid 10 hours, and even when the server starts off a little late (usually by 4pm), there's still 8 hours of maxed out slots (excluding server's spontaneous crashing). On weekdays, it varies, but activity usually kicks up around 5/6pm.

                            We do have a high player-base, however:

                            2) The server will likely never be full 24/7, that's not how this works. Since a lot of our players (PR's, not just TG's) is from North America, and a majority of them are going on EST-PST times, so we're all getting on our midday/afternoon. Our european players are getting the short end of the stick, being 5+ hours ahead, they've got to be up later to catch server primetimes; when it's reaching primetime for us, it's already 8 o'clock give or take for the Europeans.

                            You can't expect a server to be full 24/7 when the majority our playerbase needs to work and sleep simultaneously.




                            Though I'm not advocating the introduction of a second server, this misconception bugs me. The quantity and availability of players is entirely different (we can only view up to 62 at one time feasibly, there are of course many more waiting for a slot and many more fluctuating in and out of the server).

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                            • #15
                              Re: Concern over Population Increase on TG Server: Mumble Program

                              Originally posted by Superfast View Post
                              Only chance for a second server would be if it was placed in Europe. That way the TG Euros could get the server more easily seeded and active when the US is sleeping. But again two servers = split community, costs, admin-coverage etc, so it's not gonna happen. And also, the TG server does keep going 24/7 sometimes still though, but it's starting to get rare these days.
                              Agreed. The idea of any other PR TG server is crazy.
                              sigpic

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