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  • [Alpha] Offensive Strategy Discussion

    We already have a few threads for this that I'm going to have Aruncado consolidate here. Now that we know what assets we have in what configuration, let's talk about offensive strategies. Keep in mind that most plans do not survive first engagement, so let's not think too detailed or long-term.

  • #2
    Re: Offensive Strategy Discussion

    Haven't gotten to thread consolidation yet (hopefully that will be later today), but let's get some discussion going. Based on what I've read so far, it looks like we have a few basic plans in mind:

    a) take C right off the bat and attempt to hold it
    b) bum rush A or E and roll up to C
    c) split forces between A and E and try to hold enough flags on both sides to bottle them up at C and keep the bleed on

    Personally, I'm a fan of steamrolling Echo on the outset, then heading blitzkrieg-fashion for D. Once we're there we can figure out whether to go for C or bypass it for another flag. I think splitting our forces at the outset of the round will be less effective than doing so once we've gained a foothold, since we want to meet whatever the enemy is using to defend with a superior force. If we split up, we're more likely to meet a defensive force equal to what we're attacking with, which equals unfavorable conditions for us.

    What do you think?

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    • #3
      Re: Offensive Strategy Discussion

      Just throwing this out there. What about a B, and D push. Chances are the forces will be concentrated on C, E, and A. it might just get us the quick land foot hold we need. After that we could fall away from C and go back o E and A and hold 4 of the 5 bases? just throwing it out there.
      "Everyone makes fun of us rednecks with our big trucks and all our guns........until the zombie apocalypse"

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      • #4
        Re: Offensive Strategy Discussion

        Originally posted by Ven View Post
        Just throwing this out there. What about a B, and D push. Chances are the forces will be concentrated on C, E, and A. it might just get us the quick land foot hold we need. After that we could fall away from C and go back o E and A and hold 4 of the 5 bases? just throwing it out there.
        We don't want to go for B until we have a solid 2 flags already. Its a flag to hold when we have things evened out or in our favor. The winning strategy will be the push the enemy to B.

        Here is why B is the worst flag to take:
        -Its below the surrounding areas
        -Small cap radius
        -Both directions leading away from the flag are uphill and contain the worst choke points on the map. The assault from B to C is a very narrow corridor with plenty of chances for enemy infantry to gain elevation and advantage over our armor.
        -The other finger of the island has much more land to spread our forces out; B's finger is very narrow, not allowing for a spread out column
        -Very little quality cover exists in the area: the buildings are pretty destructible and don't offer much in way of cover you can return fire from.

        Some of the same can be said for D, but the surrounding area for D offers some advantages. The flag is very visible from above where our forces will be forcing a line toward C.

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        • #5
          Re: Offensive Strategy Discussion

          Originally posted by Ven View Post
          Just throwing this out there. What about a B, and D push. Chances are the forces will be concentrated on C, E, and A. it might just get us the quick land foot hold we need. After that we could fall away from C and go back o E and A and hold 4 of the 5 bases? just throwing it out there.
          We would either be in the middle of the lagoon and getting fire/spotted from both sides, or we'd spend enough time moving around that they'd see it coming. Both B and D are surrounded by chokepoints and, in D's case, its a giant deathtrap. We'd be landing without real armor against a tank from both sides, too, without the chance of getting our own armor. I think these guys should be out.

          I'd say a hard, full-team push for Alpha or Echo. Alpha is closer to the spawns and has less time over the water, Echo lets us get troops on land before we hit the flag. I've mostly seen SOFLAMs placed at Alpha and Charlie, so if we can get to the other side of the ridge away from Alpha, our vehicles should have broken those locks and we'd be okay from there. Having infantry able to repair vehicles sooner is a good idea, too, so we can hit the flag with APCs intact.

          edit: Echo -> Delta also offers a much better opportunity to pressure Charlie. While Delta itself is a terrible flag to defend, Bravo is just as bad and doesn't threaten C as well. That will pull some troops off Alpha, allowing us to swing a few troops that way and hopefully take their other tank spawn. We hit Echo hard, once Echo is taken half the team pushes to Delta while others spawn at main with any dead APCs and push back to Alpha, situations permitting.
          I can ADS using more than a 2x without significant stutter! This was a good patch.

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Offensive Strategy Discussion

            I think we should steamroll A and B at the beginning of the round, then ship 3/4 of our team to E and use bleed to win. The approaches to B and E are very very narrow, so they're pretty easy to defend.
            He was told that he should not kill, and he did not kill, until he got into the Army. Then he was told to kill, and he killed.

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            • #7
              Re: Offensive Strategy Discussion

              Full team push along one side of the map sounds great for the initial attack.

              I would suggest throwing in deception into the mix as well.
              They are a good team, they have to react to a 2 pronged attack. 1 is fake the other is real.

              Load 4 of our SLs into 1 boat and have the last SL jump into the other. Have that boat,the amtrac and transport helo run to the opposite side of the map (D/E) and fake a push.
              Have the majority of our team spawn A/B side. Steam roll and keep playing deceptive tactics to get 3 flags.

              Also remember to have IGLAs to take out errant MAVs as we make inroads into A and B. We need to constantly deny information when we push. We need to hide our numbers so they
              under-estimate our force.

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              • #8
                Re: Offensive Strategy Discussion

                We have a lot of people expressing a desire to go for A/B first. Is there a driving reason for that? I would argue that the approach to C is easier from D, and even though it takes a bit longer to get to E, we can get a foothold on land before having to take the flag. What are the advantages to taking A/B that I'm not seeing? It seems far more linear and has less maneuvering room than the E/D approach.

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                • #9
                  Re: Offensive Strategy Discussion

                  Delta flag is also a bit easier to assault from Echo. Its below Echo and very open. The flag itself isn't very defensible, but the surrounding terrain offers great advantages for both offense and defense. It also allows us to either move for the Charlie flag or harass their assets.

                  Bravo only gives defense, its too far from Charlie to give a large advantage.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Offensive Strategy Discussion

                    Originally posted by Anospa View Post
                    Delta flag is also a bit easier to assault from Echo. Its below Echo and very open. The flag itself isn't very defensible, but the surrounding terrain offers great advantages for both offense and defense. It also allows us to either move for the Charlie flag or harass their assets.

                    Bravo only gives defense, its too far from Charlie to give a large advantage.
                    I agree with this post.

                    I deserve a ribbon for Mortar Specialist

                    Artillery conquers and infantry occupies.
                    J.F.C. Fuller

                    Proud to have been a member of the 5th, 71st and my beloved 19th

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                    • #11
                      Re: Offensive Strategy Discussion

                      People like the A/B/E flag cap because their positions, once captured, denies the enemy 2 of their tank spawns. That's the key to winning. Our air will nullify the choppers. With the majority of tanks in our possession, we should be able to mount a formidable defense.

                      If you were to capture Charlie from Bravo, it's a very long attack distance with a tank to reinforce Charlie.
                      There's not enough cover unless you flank from the north beach.

                      Delta is very hard to capture and to defend well. Attacking Delta from Echo ignores the fact that the defending team can mount an effective counter-attack from Charlie. Charlie is too close and offers high ground positioning from the SAM sites.

                      It comes down to the fact that we have to hold 3 flags and A/B/E is better than A/D/E.


                      When it comes to taking Charlie first, what other flags are we hoping to capture?

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Offensive Strategy Discussion

                        Doc, are we looking at the same map?



                        A and B are really far from everything. Even if they do have that tank, it'll have to come around the entire island to get to us from A.
                        Even if it gets there, it'll have to either camp from Charlie or push down the hill into the D area where it will be at an extreme disadvantage due to the surrounding terrain. And if it does camp, it should be pretty vulnerable to chopper/jet strafing runs and allow for infantry to push further in.

                        I agree that D may be hard to take and defend, but the positives it gives us far outweigh the remoteness and narrower choke points of B.

                        I do wholeheartedly agree with you that we do need to split out attack on two fronts. One squad minimum will need to go attack A at the start of the round. Capping it fast will allow us to get bleed going quicker.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Offensive Strategy Discussion

                          Either way, D and B are both hard flags to take. I just know after many rounds on Wake that defending D is hellish and can get locked down from C quite easily. I just want a flexible commander that understands the need to shift plans when necessary. Attack what's weak and retreat when necessary.

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                          • #14
                            Re: Offensive Strategy Discussion

                            Yeah, both B and D are pretty ugly. D wins out in my head, it gives a more defensible position. The road from B to C has some great ground to assault from, but its much closer to C than B. D gives the option of having troops spawn in and being able to get in position relatively quickly. And hopefully our AMTRAC will be on guard and sitting between E and D and able to have overwatch on the flag itself.

                            Sorry for coming off brash, I was just trying to figure out what you were seeing. I was convinced that there was a flag missing off that map a few weeks ago, so I just wanted to make sure we were both on the same page on where the flags were positioned.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: Offensive Strategy Discussion

                              Assuming we decide to go E and D, with the goal of taking C:

                              1) As we try to take C, and they begin to focus their attention on defending toward D, we can have a MAV operator occasionally check A and B. If left undefended, we can air-drop a team to ninja-cap it. This should infuriate them and draw resources away from C.

                              2) While figthing on the front betwixt D and C, we could try to sneak our Amtrac around the outside of the horseshoe, past E, past D, and behind the airfield. From there, we could create a flanking front they have to deal with.
                              BF4: Indiscrimin8

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