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  • Commander-SL Comms and Whisper

    I wonder if an interim solution to the lack of flexible VOIP comms available for SL-CO comms could be solved via TS whisper. I'll give it a try tonight but it will only work if SLs also use TS whisper to communicate with the CO. It takes about 10 seconds to set this up in TS.

    Any thoughts on this?
    sigpic

  • #2
    Re: Commander-SL Comms and Whisper

    I have previously suggested that people use the BF4 sl channels for sl to sl & co to all sl comms and in game for squad stuff. This is somewhat dependent on in game being consistent but its actuall less complicated than whisper lists which you would have to update. Sadly for various reasons, possibly including inconsistent in game voip, people seem happy to either sit in a single channel with both teams or in their IHS channels. This won't address the teamwide coordination issues people are talking about but as with any solution you have to be willing to actually do something about it.


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    • #3
      Re: Commander-SL Comms and Whisper

      E-male, two thirds of the squad leaders would be pubs that are not in TeamSpeak. Would be a good idea except for that.

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      • #4
        Re: Commander-SL Comms and Whisper

        Wicks,

        Opps. I did not mean to undermine what the Admis are trying to achieve vis a vis TS channels. My only concern with the structure you suggest (above) is that while VOIP remains less than 100% functional it is necessary to gather squad mates into a dedicated TS channel (IHS or otherwise, thus my prior call for more granular assignments of TS channels by squad name of reach team).

        The single channel has no use for me, aside form occasional visits between rounds.

        OldGunny: true, whisper will not work as a work-around when SLs are mostly non-TGers. Nonetheless, there are often times (the busier nights) when we have mostly TG SLs.

        Granted, my whisper "solution" still requires those TG SLs to learn how to use whisper and use it.

        Not much of a solution, but even having 50% of SLs in direct comms with the CO via Whisper would be better than the current situation.
        sigpic

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        • #5
          Re: Commander-SL Comms and Whisper

          Originally posted by E-Male View Post
          lack of flexible VOIP comms available for SL-CO comms
          It seems to me the only thing missing is the ability for the SL to speak to the CO on-demand without any sort of protocol.

          Originally posted by Namebot View Post
          I prefer the way the CO coms work now. As CO you no longer get interrupted mid sentence by another SL trying to talk to you. Plus the SL doesn't have to repeat everything to the squad members. Much better on both sides for me.
          That 'not interrupted' logic goes the other way as well - SL's no longer have CO and SM's talking to you at the same time (since CO can hear squad.)

          To me the question is how do we, as SL, get the CO's attention promptly?

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          • #6
            Re: Commander-SL Comms and Whisper

            Emale no apology necessary at all, I didn't think that for one minute, merely pointing out I have offered one potential solution previously that has been largely ignored. The current system also lacks the ability for SL's to talk to each other, something people continuously overlook, we don't have a CO every round.

            Having 50% of the SL's in an SL channel does the same as the proposed whisper list, without setting up a whisper list. It would also act as a Command Net where all SL's are on the same page, which has some RL equivalences for good reason. The stumbling block appears to me to be personal preference, ie, "I want to sit in a private channel".


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            • #7
              Re: Commander-SL Comms and Whisper

              I for one will start to use the separate channels. This is my single biggest gripe with this game and I need to practise what I preach. I hope I'm not too lonely.
              sigpic

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              • #8
                Re: Commander-SL Comms and Whisper

                No need for whisper lists, just start encouraging your team's Squad Leaders and CO to use the SL channels for their team.
                Skud


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                • #9
                  Re: Commander-SL Comms and Whisper

                  Todd I suspect many of us are guilty of sitting in other channels at times for many reasons, flaky squad VoIP being one of them, however an SL channel may help a bit with coordination. When I SL I'll try and join you, I think its worth giving it a decent try. Fingers crossed the squad VoIP is improving.


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                  • #10
                    Re: Commander-SL Comms and Whisper

                    In PS2, I play with the Devil Dogs, an outfit with over 3,000 members. On ops days, we have fielded over 300 players at once, all organized on teamspeak into a command and control structure.
                    We have a system of handling those critical communication lines between different divisions (Air, Armor, Infantry, etc), and within those divisions, broken down by platoon and squad (with 12-man squads, in case you aren't familiar).

                    It's a system that works - but relies on 2 things to *fully* work:
                    1) ALL players are in teamspeak. There *are no* non-members on TS. That's different than the TG TS, where we get "pubbies" who aren't on TS.
                    2) It requires:
                    2a) Admins to set up a Server Group called "Squad Leader"
                    2b) SLs to assign themselves to the "Squad Leader" Server Group
                    2c) SLs to set up a hotkey to whisper to whisper to "Server Group: 'Squad Leaders' in Complete Channel Family"

                    So - it's not without obstacles. However, once implemented, it's a fabulous solution - for anyone using TS.

                    If the VOIP doesn't get fixed, and we ultimately have to do our own thing, I recommend we explore something like this.

                    Certainly - if we want to have a Scrimmage, or a match against another community, and DICE *still* hasn't given us what we need for comms...
                    Well, we *can't* do a scrim with the comms as they are.

                    And I believe that whatever we're going to do for comms in scrims is what we should be doing on the servers for "regular play."
                    BF4: Indiscrimin8

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                    • #11
                      Re: Commander-SL Comms and Whisper

                      If we do organized matches, of course we'd use TS rather than VOIP, and even in scrimmages where the game in question had a working VOIP, we used TS. But what you're suggesting just isn't feasible for an loose confederation like TG.

                      On ops days, we have fielded over 300 players at once, all organized on teamspeak into a command and control structure.
                      On ops days. I don't know how many days those are, but asking people to do that in an organized way a few times a week for a couple of hours is vastly different than asking people to do it every time they log in. The server is usually at least semi-full around 12 hours a day every day.

                      I think you may have the wrong idea here. While I hope TG will continue the tradition of having both intramural and community vs. community scrimmages, this isn't the point of TG. No one is acting like our actions right now are designed to prepare us for that day when we take on another 32 player team. That's just icing on the cake. The cake is the cake.
                      .

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                      • #12
                        Re: Commander-SL Comms and Whisper

                        Originally posted by Zoraster View Post
                        On ops days. I don't know how many days those are, but asking people to do that in an organized way a few times a week for a couple of hours is vastly different than asking people to do it every time they log in. The server is usually at least semi-full around 12 hours a day every day.
                        Lemme clarify:
                        On ops days, we fielded over 300 ... blah, blah.
                        EVERY DAY, 24/7, we used the SOP I described for TS comms.
                        Depending on the community - and their level of committment - it's definitely *not* too much to ask. In fact, there were a couple more levels of comms SOP, including yet another Server Group (Radio Operator).
                        It all works in a community that's dedicated to teamplay and organization. Which TG is; the only difference is that the Devil Dogs can count on every person playing to be in TS. TG can't. But that doesn't mean that we couldn't use that system for every playing TG member. "Pubbies" could be the only ones who aren't participating.
                        BF4: Indiscrimin8

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                        • #13
                          Re: Commander-SL Comms and Whisper

                          and missing out on VOIP. And not, for example, getting hooked like this guy.
                          .

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                          • #14
                            Re: Commander-SL Comms and Whisper

                            Whoa, hey.
                            You're making assumptions.
                            I am not suggesting we ever stop using in-game voip to try to include non-TG players.
                            BF4: Indiscrimin8

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                            • #15
                              Re: Commander-SL Comms and Whisper

                              Originally posted by Zoraster View Post
                              If we do organized matches, of course we'd use TS rather than VOIP, and even in scrimmages where the game in question had a working VOIP, we used TS. But what you're suggesting just isn't feasible for an loose confederation like TG.

                              On ops days. I don't know how many days those are, but asking people to do that in an organized way a few times a week for a couple of hours is vastly different than asking people to do it every time they log in. The server is usually at least semi-full around 12 hours a day every day.

                              I think you may have the wrong idea here. While I hope TG will continue the tradition of having both intramural and community vs. community scrimmages, this isn't the point of TG. No one is acting like our actions right now are designed to prepare us for that day when we take on another 32 player team. That's just icing on the cake. The cake is the cake.
                              I can second Indiscriminate. I spent a few months playing with and eventually running a division in the 666th. Ops days (when I was around) were a weekly event, and usually lasted from 3pm EST well into the night in some cases. Usually I'd be on at the start at 3pm EST and play until 11pm with a break for food in there somewhere. Basically an Op Day was an hours long affair. (I wound up leaving due to schoolwork and administrative burn out, it just wasn't fun anymore)

                              Their TS3 setup is an ingenious solution, and it isn't too hard to set up on the client end with the help of some step by step walkthroughs, but the server side does require some monkeying with permissions, groups, and channel order. If we were to implement it at TG right now, the only people who would technically need to configure their whisper lists would be squad leaders and commanders. Squad based voip could be handled by the in game voip in our case, but SL <-> CO comms would be by whisper list targeting a group.

                              In practice however, every single person who comes onto our TS for BF4 would need to setup the necessary whisper list and be familiar with our system. Basically it becomes another barrier of entry. The Devil Dogs can do it because they are massive and a major player in the Planetside 2 community. We're big by most standards, but not so big that we have that luxury. Ideally, we could provide such a desirable server environment that players would do whatever is necessary to get in and play, but for the moment we do not.

                              Part of me kind of thinks that a whisper based solution could work, but drag and dropping the 666th's solution doesn't strike me as the silver bullet. This has gotten me thinking though, I need to do some research and see if there's an easier solution.

                              "Over the din of battle could be heard Lancerís maniacal laughter and it spurned us on to stay the course, not to give up, and enjoy." - Grimmfist

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