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  • On Knifing

    The subject has popped up in several threads already, I figure it deserves its own topic.

    Knifing. It's annoying, it's humiliating, it's a slap in the face.

    It is also ridiculously efficient, relatively silent, and faster than firing your gun.

    So where should we, as TGers, stand on the issue? I hate being knifed as much as the next guy. It genuinely infuriates me, in fact, because I know it means I made a grievous tactical error most of the time.

    However, the new mechanics of the knife make it entirely possible to surprise and defeat a superior force or an enemy with an initial situational advantage. For example, I was sniping at mid range targets on a conquest map. I was feeling pretty secure since the points on either side were friendly controlled. Out of nowhere a hostile assault soldier shows up and damn near lays me out before I could pop into cover. I had 2 options: draw my pistol and try and headshot my way to victory, or run away. I chose the third: I sprinted out the backside of the building, back around it, and arrived behind the enemy soldier who was cautiously inching his way into the building. My blade went into his back and I emerged victorius from a totally unfair engagement that was tilted strongly in favor of my enemy.

    This is the kind of tactics we should be using with the knife. Without IDS wallhacks, and recon balls deployed few and far between, stealth, surprise, and efficency with the knife is very viable. When you don't have time to reload, are surprised around a corner, or need to stealthily eliminate your enemies, you can and should be using your knife.

    What I don't want to see is someone rushing me from 10 m with a full gun magazine just knife me. That's suicidal, and should be reported.

    Verdict: The knife is a potent and tactical weapon in BC2, learn to use it, and soon you will find that you are the one coming out on top more often than not.




    "Cum bellum clamavit, nos respondivi..."


    "I've given everything I can... There are no heroes left in man..."

  • #2
    Re: On Knifing

    Being rushed and knifed head-on while your LMG rounds are thumping into said knifers chest is rather annoying. Wish there were some mechanic like knock-back or melee being unavailable to you while your eating lead.

    Maybe someone can clarify for me but from my end knifing seems to take a long time. The animation shows me drawing my knife back Norman Bates style for what seems like forever (really only a half a second or so) before I plunge it in. Does the actual kill happen immediately server side even though it seems to be happening in slo-mo on my end?

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    • #3
      Re: On Knifing

      *shrugs* Honestly, I'm of the opinion that it's part of the game. I know that we frown upon suicide tactics and bunny-hopping, but... with weapons I'm neutral. The knife is the way it is because Dice wanted it that way. There's always hardcore mode where the higher damage output stops the knife rushes, but then you have to deal with deadly snipers who can easily kill you if you run around in the open.

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      • #4
        Re: On Knifing

        Originally posted by Gill View Post
        There's always hardcore mode, but then you have to deal with deadly snipers who can easily kill you if you run around in the open.
        That's the one thing that deters me from joining the HC server, I join the HC server only if the other two are full for this reason alone. You don't necessarily need to be running around out in the open either, if your elbow is exposed to a sniper while behind cover you're history.

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        • #5
          Re: On Knifing

          I really don't like the new knifing mechanics. It's simply way too easy and completely removes the vulnerability you felt sneaking up on someone with your knife drawn knowing that they could turn around at any second and blast you.

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          • #6
            Re: On Knifing

            Agreed
            I think it should get warned at least and kicked after several times since if youre on one side of a building and they bum rush you to get the dog tags, they should get warned
            Like 3 times I'd say
            sigpic
            <a href="http://www.metro2033forum.net">metro 2033 forum</a>

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            • #7
              Re: On Knifing

              Is it really TG to start setting rules about what weapon in the game that we are aloud to use? Then the server will become like one of the weirdest server I ever played on in bf2142. No commander, no PK rockets, No IDS/PDS. The reason?" It gives you an unfair advantages against the enemy." Unfair what? Everyone have the same chance of using things like knife, grenade-launcher improved demo-perks. If I like this game and plays it allot or simply is very good at playing as a medic and gets lots and lots of points should I be punished for that?
              Nubhar

              - In the process, I have discovered that I can make iron bolts with my butt****.

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              • #8
                Re: On Knifing

                I think you might have missed my point Abel, I was trying to point out that the moaning and complaining about knifing should have no place here at TG, in direct response to posts elsewhere about that very thing ( I myself was guilty of it at first too).

                The only caveat I had was those people that go out of their way to knife rush you without any sense of tactics or self-preservation, and that they should be dealt with like they were in 2142.




                "Cum bellum clamavit, nos respondivi..."


                "I've given everything I can... There are no heroes left in man..."

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                • #9
                  Re: On Knifing

                  I know I need to learn to use the knife.
                  I keep shooting instead of stabbing when Im next to the enemy.
                  Just ends up with me being the one knifed.
                  Gotta work on building the knife reflex.

                  Now, can we ban the d*mned snipers I can never see ? ;)

                  |

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                  • #10
                    Re: On Knifing

                    @kelvin.

                    I know. I was speaking to those who want well not forbid you too use the knife but bloody close..
                    I hated being knifed before. Because it ment that I had screwed something up and failed as a tactical player. Now I hate being knifed because it more often then now means that someone have been eating lead while running across a half damn footballfield to knife me..
                    Nubhar

                    - In the process, I have discovered that I can make iron bolts with my butt****.

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                    • #11
                      Re: On Knifing

                      I say screw it, I have 60 knife kills now and desire a lot more. Yesterday on that level from the beta we were defending and I emptied my entire magazine from my AN94 into 2 guys who then had people spawn on them, drew my 1911, dropped two more then knifed another 3 all at once in a flurry of comms and adrenalin, before getting shot in the middle of the face. It was soooo exhilarating, having no time to reload and just flicking between my 3 weapons on my 3 mouse buttons. I think it was Asch who said he saw it all on his death cam? Man was I screaming like a girl in the middle of it! I love my knife. I want a sword!!

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                      • #12
                        Re: On Knifing

                        I think the knife serves its purpose. As long as you dont abuse it, I/E running around with just the knife slashing away like a madman. I have lost count of how many times I have either snuck up on 733tSniper322 and instead of shooting him decided to give a little payback for the trouble he caused our team and stuck a blade in his dome piece or jumped into the middle of a respawning squad. There is nothing more gratifying than stabing the dude who killed you 10 times in the face. I think as long as we just keep the knife in the last option/stealthy sniper elimination category it will be ok. Besides, how else am I supposed to add to my Jeepo Dogtag Collection :D

                        [unit][squadl][command2]

                        KnyghtMare ~You could always tell the person holding the gun to your head you would like to play on a different server...

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                        • #13
                          Re: On Knifing

                          Originally posted by Abel View Post
                          Is it really TG to start setting rules about what weapon in the game that we are aloud to use?
                          TacticalGamer became popular because we've hosted servers where you can't just play the game any way you want. You can't exploit anything the game engine allows. You can't use any weapon any way that you like. TacticalGamer has completely banned weapons before, and TG is based on encouraging gameplay to be as tactical and realistic as possible.

                          With that said, and keeping in mind that I haven't actually made it onto a TG BC2 server, I would say that we want a compromise from what is being described. I don't think anyone wants to see a "no knives" rule, but neither does anyone want to see idiots putting away their primary weapon to charge headlong at the enemy with a knife. We all know that knives are appropriate when you sneak up behind a sniper, or you get the jump on a machine gunner concentrating on laying down cover fire, but exploiting the game engine by taking advantage of the hit point issues is NOT what TG is all about.
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                          • #14
                            Re: On Knifing

                            hmmm....guess I never seen it as an issue? if they come at me I hit the knife key as well.
                            "Everyone makes fun of us rednecks with our big trucks and all our guns........until the zombie apocalypse"

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                            • #15
                              Re: On Knifing

                              Sprint perk + extra armor = me running around stabbing people.

                              Was it fun? Yes. Was it realistic or tactical? No. The knife has gone from a true skill weapon in 1942, to a somewhat difficult to use, but one hit kill in BF2/2142, to what I think is now a pandering to the lowest common denominator. Knives are cool to the Mountain Dew swilling console kiddies, and they're only cool if you can slash with one button and OMG ownzzorr people. You should not be able to bring a knife to gunfight and win. As a stealth weapon, yes stealth is good, flanking is good. However, if caught reloading by someone with a loaded weapon, you should not be able to sprint at them and bury a knife in their face to win the encounter.

                              Unfortunately the devs decided we would get the COD knife and so here we are. I don't know what to think. The argument is that running at someone with a knife is a suicide tactic. Well, in BC2, it isn't. You actually have a good chance of winning the encounter. It's stupid that it is a viable tactic, but it is in fact a viable tactic in this game.

                              For me though, knifing no longer represents a true skill kill. Repair tools, defibs, C4 on a camping sniper, pegging someone with a non exploding GL round....impressive. The magic knife...not so much, IMO. Comparing my dogtag set in BC2 and 2142, you see that I have 4 sets of, for example, Zhohar's tags in BC2, and none in 2142. BC2 has been out for 6 days....I played 2142 on TG for months. You see what I'm talking about.

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