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How can we make a better team -- on the fly, and realistically.

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  • How can we make a better team -- on the fly, and realistically.

    Gents --

    Teamwork is what we do. The game's been out for a month -- what can we do to pimp this up? What can we do to make it *crystal clear* to outsiders that they are now in our domain, and it's a whole 'nother ballgame.

    We need suggestions to pimp up our teamwork. What can each of us to do make the team more effective? What is currently lacking? What can we do better -- on the fly -- to make us more effective?

    Give us ideas on what to say, how to help, how to behave even, how to run kits, what to focus on, how to make our objectives clear, how to ask for help, how to increase co-operation, how to get quickly respond to things, how to get things done without being a punk to people, how to get people to do boring things that help -- the key idea is to make a generic TG team more effective, and to up the gameplay on our server.

    How do we do it?

  • #2
    Re: How can we make a better team -- on the fly, and realistically.

    I think one of the main things that we could do would be load outs. Make sure that every member of the squad has a loadout that benefits the squad and the entire team. Fill in everyone on what is needed for that round or what have you. You could even go so far as to assign kits to squads. I/E everyone knows that if you are in Alpha or whatever, you should be assault. This way players that join can, at a glance, see what kit is lacking and what loadout they should prepare before entering the battlefield.

    [unit][squadl][command2]

    KnyghtMare ~You could always tell the person holding the gun to your head you would like to play on a different server...

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    • #3
      Re: How can we make a better team -- on the fly, and realistically.

      From a new person (to TG) perspective, having a dedicated leader goes a long way. Someone who can take control of the team, and organize the masses. If you find yourself in a new team, and your teammates are all following orders and doing their part, one will naturally want to do the same as well.

      Unfortunately, I think this can only be done through TS. Doing it through the in-game chat is ineffective, at best. In the heat of the battle, I tend to occasionally miss what's being said there. Through TS, having one voice saying "That tank at A is a problem. We need a couple of engie's to take it out, anyone up for the task?" will really give the impression of coordination and organization. The "rub-off effect" is that once people volunteer, others will want to do their part to contribute for future tasks. If I see and hear my teammates doing their part, I will want to avoid being dead-weight and help out also.

      The catch is that often times, people don't enjoy being bossed around, either. No one wants to be bossed around by someone they don't know, so it will take some trust on the receiver's end to actually follow orders. This works best when issuing orders to members who are familiar with the leader and will follow no questions asked. Once things get rolling, other teammates will fall in line.

      Again, the problem with this is this only applies to those in TS. For those who aren't, I think a friendly invitation goes a long way. A lot of servers message about their vent and TS servers, but I rarely have the motivation to join because who knows what's going on in there. Maybe there's communication, maybe no one's there. As a new player to the servers, it goes a long way if someone (esp. with a |TG| tag) invited me to servers in-game: "Hey Brokeback, if you got a mic, come join us in TS. We've got a lot of the team there and you could really help us out." (Pvt Brokeback is my in-game name, and I do join TS everytime, I'm just using myself as an example).

      Point being, increased communication is always a good thing, esp. when it comes to teamwork. A personal message to others goes an exponentially long way of increasing communication.


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      • #4
        Re: How can we make a better team -- on the fly, and realistically.

        Work with your squad in chat. If a random pubby is in your squad as medic and revives you, say thanks. Let them know that you are acknowledging their existence and you appreciate their actions. Reciprocate with similar actions and hopefully they'll start tagging along.

        Use a NICE BIG EYE CATCHING FORMAT in team chat and call off targets.

        Keep it simple. ALPHA & CHARLIE SQUADS HIT B.

        ARMOR COMING FROM D, TAKE IT OUT.

        RECONS DEPLOY MOTION SENSORS.

        Short, simple, LARGE, sentences. Hopefully the teamwork should evolve organically with little pushes like this.


        Lastly, be polite to people in the server, thank them for sticking around for so many rounds, you enjoyed playing with them, they should check out the site.

        Don't tell them they're a noob, an idiot, or stfu, etc. etc. That makes you, us, and the server look bad. We wan't good word of mouth like "Yea Tactical Gamer is a pretty awesome teamwork oriented server, they got some funny rules, but it doesn't ruin the experience", not "Oh those guys are a bunch of elitist pricks who scream at you if you don't play their way exactly 100% of the time."

        Plenty of teamplay games got by just fine without voice chat back in the day, so the whole "Impossible to organize without voip!" is pretty bunk, commit yourself to pushing out orders and ideally it should pan out.

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        • #5
          Re: How can we make a better team -- on the fly, and realistically.

          It's tough with the game designed the way it is. It's been said many times before, but without a chain of command to give ORDERS instead of suggestions, teamwork can easily suffer. Great teamwork and coordination is possible and happens when the right group of people get together and work together toward the common goal of winning, without having to be told what to do. Then there are times when you have a lot of people on your team who even if they are in TS just don't care about doing what it takes to win and want to play their way. These people need to be bossed around, they need to be told what to do if the team is going to pull off a win, but it just isn't going to happen without orders to follow.

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          • #6
            Re: How can we make a better team -- on the fly, and realistically.

            In general, more organization and communication is always a good thing. It really helps the team when a person in each squad steps up and acts as a pseudo-squad leader in TS with his squadmates following. Simple things like, "Alpha Squad defending Objective A" let the squad know what their responsibility is and encourages staying close to your squad and at the same time lets the rest of the team know what tasks are covered and what tasks might need more attention.

            ^What Dredge said above. At the squad level, I think it really makes a big difference being in a squad that is balanced, rather than heavy on one or two classes. A balanced squad is capable of taking on basically any obstacle. Countless times I've found myself in a situation where my squad maybe ran into some armor, but we weren't equipped to handle it because we had no engie or recon AT. Or sometimes we're in a squad with no medic and we bleed too many tickets. It doesn't help that you can't see what your squadmates are using until you've already spawned in. At the team level, it's even easier to become unbalanced because you can't even see what teammates outside of your squad are equipped with. We should all try to make it a point to communicate what kit you're using or what kits the squad/team needs through TS/chat.

            Conquest Specific Point: On some maps, a typical TS log will look like "Let's go for Bravo. Ok done, what next? Oh Alpha is flashing, let's go get Alpha. Ok done, what next? Oh crap we're losing Bravo, let's go back to Bravo." And while this is going on it's basically the entire team, minus a few stragglers, migrating from objective to objective and leaving secured objectives behind practically defenseless. I think it would be much more effective if we communicated specific squads to securing or defending objectives. Acquiring and more importantly holding objectives should lead to more effective team play.
            "Looking for brahs to come fight crime with me" - Unload



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            • #7
              Re: How can we make a better team -- on the fly, and realistically.

              Ok, here is my idea. Alpha squad is ALWAYS the lead squad and its squad leader is the default commander. If you don't want to be in the lead squad.. STAY OUT of alpha squad. From here, the commander can command the team. She/he can give commands to the squad leaders by using squad names. "Bravo squad stay in defense". "Charlie squad attack MCOM B" etc. But usually Alpha squad should not be doing anything that is going to keep it constantly in harm's way. They may get the boring tasks of staying in reserve or defending a back flag in conquest.

              That said, we must have an organized plan, even if only in the commanders head, of how the team is defending or attacking. As VooDoo IT mentioned above, we must stop the constant swarming of the entire team and break down individual responsibilities by squad.

              Hope that helped.
              |TG-Irr| Laci's Ghost

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              • #8
                Re: How can we make a better team -- on the fly, and realistically.

                Probably the most dissapointing aspect of this game is the abandonment of the commander role - this was such an innovation in BF2 and BF2142 and I can see how BC2 suffers without one.

                I can somewhat understand why they did it given that unless you were playing in a clan or community the commander was essentially a support position on the battlefield - just supply me, drop arty when I need it, put up UAVs, and shut the hell up otherwise.

                It would have been nice for it to be an option that could be turned on and off depending on server preference.

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                • #9
                  Re: How can we make a better team -- on the fly, and realistically.

                  Keep the squad tightly together. Never spawn on a flag, always on a squad member. Let the non-tg players see this and they will do the same.
                  What I miss from 2142 is the string of squad members on the map moving towards the same objective, in BC2 the squad is easily split up in all the commotion. Make sure everyone in your squad knows the current objective, either via TS or chat.
                  sigpic


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                  • #10
                    Re: How can we make a better team -- on the fly, and realistically.

                    I haven't had time to play as much lately but all our main issues still appear to revolve around communication. We are all used to the previous BF games where your squad coms did not affect the other squads and you went through a CO for team organization. Transitioning to this inferior setup in BC2 is difficult. Some of the pieces to this puzzle:

                    - TS channels are for team chat - The more people say things that are unimportant to the team as a whole the less effective we will be. It clouds the important team info or in game sounds we should be hearing. For those that participated, think back to what you heard in the SL TS channels for the previous BF games. We need to get to that on a larger scale and more people using squad whispers would help a lot here.(because its super easy and awesome for everyone)

                    - Clarity of coms - See part 3 of the TS section and this thread.

                    - Group think - the bad kind. One of the most frustrating times when playing commander in BF2/2142 is when you may announce intel to the team and on their own the entire team collectively reacts and opens up multiple weaknesses elsewhere. We need better discipline on playing your role/area of coverage. We also need better coms on what level of reaction is needed and who will react. For example when you hear in TS 'Squad flanking east toward A, need help' or 'We need to stop them from using the hill to rain down ATs' don't automatically have everyone react to that. If your squad is in the area announce you will respond. If the task requires more people the original request for help should have stated so or the responding squad can call for more backup.

                    - Group think - the good kind. On the fly proposals for team wide tactics need to be easy to understand, acknowledged and carried out with everyone on board quickly. Coordinated assaults on rush toward a specific mcom with armor/inf working together typically works beautifully. Conquest of course needs agreement on what flags the team wants to hold or how to react when something goes wrong. Regardless of the skill level of the team, good things happen when this is occurring.

                    Work on these communication areas and teams can become well oiled machines that will stomp through objectives on the fly.
                    |TG-12th|mantis

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                    • #11
                      Re: How can we make a better team -- on the fly, and realistically.

                      Originally posted by general_alvin View Post
                      Keep the squad tightly together. Never spawn on a flag, always on a squad member. Let the non-tg players see this and they will do the same.
                      What I miss from 2142 is the string of squad members on the map moving towards the same objective, in BC2 the squad is easily split up in all the commotion. Make sure everyone in your squad knows the current objective, either via TS or chat.
                      I do not know how much this must be stressed, I can not count how many time I have flanked successfully on a rush map and ended up hiding behind an mcom waiting for my 3 other squadmates to spawn. 75% of the time, a TG member will spawn on me, usually only because I announced where I was in TS and in chat, asked them to do so. The rest of the time, almost always the pubbies will instead spawn in the main base or somewhere else, for God knows what reason, even with the green text floating in front of them saying to spawn on me next time they die.



                      Former TG-21st
                      Swift Mobile On Target

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                      • #12
                        Re: How can we make a better team -- on the fly, and realistically.

                        Originally posted by Darth_Napoleon View Post
                        I do not know how much this must be stressed, I can not count how many time I have flanked successfully on a rush map and ended up hiding behind an mcom waiting for my 3 other squadmates to spawn. 75% of the time, a TG member will spawn on me, usually only because I announced where I was in TS and in chat, asked them to do so. The rest of the time, almost always the pubbies will instead spawn in the main base or somewhere else, for God knows what reason, even with the green text floating in front of them saying to spawn on me next time they die.
                        That's interesting. Instinctively, if a squad mate snuck behind the defenders, I automatically spawn on them to support... plus you're closer to the action. I have no clue why someone wouldn't want to spawn on you.


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                        • #13
                          Re: How can we make a better team -- on the fly, and realistically.

                          Kdr?

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                          • #14
                            Re: How can we make a better team -- on the fly, and realistically.

                            Originally posted by jazy2 View Post
                            Kdr?
                            Most likely - the general pubbie mindset is why bother getting those two mcoms if you can get 10 extra kills from just slogging up the middle; oh if only EA had not tried to pull over all of those COD players :(



                            Former TG-21st
                            Swift Mobile On Target

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                            • #15
                              Re: How can we make a better team -- on the fly, and realistically.

                              In terms of inviting non-TG players to TS, can we add a blurb about joining TS, and give the IP, etc., to our server "splash" that is shown as the map loads?

                              THEDOGWARRIOR... CALL ME DOG / WILL NOT RESPOND TO "HERE BOY" OR WHISTLING

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