Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Schwa's Guide: de_Penstock. Defense.

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Schwa's Guide: de_Penstock. Defense.

    To begin with, lets clear up some locations! All underlined text is a link to an image.


    Overlay. Feel free to download and put your own gameplan on =)

    Labeled Areas:
    Please use these terms when referring to specific locations.

    Bombsite A
    Bombsite B
    Red Control Room or just Red Room. NOT Right room.
    Blue Control Room or just Blue Room. NOT Left room.
    Locker Rooms
    Blast Room
    Steam Room
    Catwalks
    Red Control Room Roof or Red Roof or just Roof.
    Gas Station
    Terrorist Blast Room
    The Fence
    Terrorist Blast Door Box or just The Box.
    Catwalk Stairs
    The Dumpster
    Red Control Room Sewer or just Red Sewer.
    Blue Control Room Sewer or just Blue Sewer
    Last edited by Root; 01-16-2007, 06:05 PM. Reason: Typo corrections as requested by Schwa

  • #2
    Re: Schwa's Guide: de_Penstock. Defense.

    General Thoughts

    General strategy like this is not a recipie for a gauranteed win. Instead one has to consider what gives the team tactical advantage. More often than not, numbers win. A 6 player rush will overwhelm a 2 player defense.

    However, as on any bomb map, the counter-terrorists have the advantage of taking cover and waiting for terrorist to simply walk past their crosshair. Penstock is especially important in this regard.

    The terrorists have two* good ways to win on Penstock: the wait and pick, or a red/blue control room rush. If the CTs take cover and don't engage in "picking" fire the T's will have to commit themselves to a bombsite before learning enemy positions. This is a crucial aspect to winning.

    Penstock shouldn't be thought of as a typical two bombsite map. The middle room contains the majority of the approaches and thus should be heavily guarded. With few exceptions*, the team that manages to secure the middle room is the team that wins the map.

    Further, holding blue control room is rather unnecessary from a defensive position. It leads to the back of the blast door, which isn't helpful for the Ts if the CTs still hold the center room. Or it will lead to bombsite A, which can be quickly reinforced from the catwalks. If CTs are holding the catwalks, they will be able to fire on terrorist making a blue control room rush, than simply wait for them to assault A or B, no ground is lost.

    *Going water is a rarely used tactic due to the incredible difficulty of moving up a defended ladder.
    Last edited by Root; 01-16-2007, 06:07 PM. Reason: Typo corrections as requested by Schwa

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Schwa's Guide: de_Penstock. Defense.

      Plan A

      "Even Coverage"

      Positions
      At the begining of the round the leader is to announce the plan and assign these roles, or allow players to nominate themselves. For clarity, players should TYPE THEIR POSITION in teamchat after being assigned, so all players have a rough guide as to where the other is. This is helpful if players die without being able to radio enemy positions.

      Sewer Guy
      Armed with: M4 or Shotty.
      In every plan one player will be in the Steam Room watching the sewers. I will cover his job here and make little note of it in other plans.

      Sewer Guy will often find himself round after round doing very little. For this reason, the weakest member of the squad should be assigned to this position. The primary function here is to let the T's know that every round the sewer route will be guarded. Often times, the T's will try to sneak a player up the sewers in hopes of getting behind the Catwalk defenders, or as a quick way to Bomsite A.

      If the Sewer Guy is doing a good job, he probobly won't ever see much action.

      While watching the ladder is an important job, Sewer Guy is also expected to reinforce Bomsite A if the defenders in Blue Room or Locker Rooms die.

      Finially, Sewer Guy is to keep in constant communication with players defending the Catwalks or Red Controll Room Roof. If the middle room is being compromised Sewer Guy can move up Catwalk Stairs to take a peek around, but really shouldn't move up further.

      Blast Room Guy and Locker Room Guy squad.
      Armed with: M4, MP5, Shotty.

      One player is to hold the Blast Room. One is to hold the Locker Rooms. Blast door is to remain shut.

      This squad should be in constant communication with each other, and the Sewer Guy. This squad will receive information from players on the Catwalks, letting them know if any terrorists have moved past Blue Controll Room.

      The primary function here is to wait for a Blue Controll Room rush and catch terrorist as they try to move into
      Bomsite A.

      The player in the Blast Room should make himself apparent to any T's moving through the locker room, to distract fire from the hidden Locker Room defender. Suggestion positions are on the overlay.

      Finially, if the defenders in the middle room have gone down, both the Locker Room Guy and the Blast Room Guy should be prepared to open the blast door and hopefully catch terrorists attempting to plant the bomb. If Sewer Guy is still alive, this should be co-ordinated with him as he moves up the Catwalk Stairs.

      Red Roof Squad
      Armed with: M4, Clarion, Scout, Bullpup.

      Two players should camp on top of the Red Controll Room Roof. One is to hug the far right wall and focus his attention on terrorists moving out onto the Catwalks. The other is to focus his attention on The Fence or Blue Controll Room.

      This squad will be relaying info to the Locker Room Guy and request backup from Sewer Guy.

      This squad will receive information from The Box guy and can move to assist a Red Controll Room Roof rush. If Sewer Guy falls, one from the Red Roof Squad should move to hold the Steam Room.

      The Box Guy
      Armed with: M4.

      This player is to hide by Terrorist Blast Door Box and focus attention on the Red Controll Room. If done properly he will be out of sight from T's approaching The Fence. The primary job of this position is to watch for a Red Controll Room rush.

      This position will relay information to the Red Roof Squad if terrorist are advancing in the Red Controll Room.
      Last edited by What Is Schwa?; 01-16-2007, 05:52 PM.

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Schwa's Guide: de_Penstock. Defense.

        Plan B

        "The Hidden Assault."

        The Blue Controll Room is left undefended and all players are hidden from view if the terrorist do take that route. The other routes are heavily defended and an assault on those points shouldn't have any problems. Most likely the Terrorist will be a little confused and edgy if they DO move up the blue room and will be moving slow. The Gas Station Attendant is a key player for Plan B.

        Positions
        At the begining of the round the leader is to announce the plan and assign these roles, or allow players to nominate themselves. For clarity, players should TYPE THEIR POSITION in teamchat after being assigned, so all players have a rough guide as to where the other is. This is helpful if players die without being able to radio enemy positions.

        The Gas Station Attendant or just Gas Station Guy =)
        Armed with: Scout or Bullpup and a good sidearm.

        This position is a stealth one. If done right, the defending playing can hide in the gas station and not be seen from the Locker Room stair entrance to Bomsite A. If A is penetrated the Gas Station Guy should simply watch and remain hidden until bomber has been identified. If bomber has been identified all other players should be moving through the Catwalk Stairs or Blast Room.

        On the Gas Station Guy's signal, the Sewer Guy should move into Bomsite A and draw fire from the terrorists. At this moment, the Gas Station Guy can open fire and will probobly remain unseen until the Sewer Guy is dead.

        Sewer Guy
        Armed with: M4, Shotty.

        Similar to Plan A, however Sewer Guy will be taking his cues from Gas Station Guy

        Blue Sewer Guy
        Armed with: M4, Clarion, Bullpup.

        This position should keep an eye on the Red Controll Room Roof and Catwalks. The Red Room Guy will be depending on his ability to first spot terrorist enter the Red Controll Room and provide some distraction fire.

        Blue Sewer Guy is also in a good position to kill any terrorist who sneak throught the Blast Room and try to plant on the T's side of the boxes at Bombiste B.

        Red Controll Room Guy
        Armed with: M4, MP5, Shotty.

        This position should hide in the back corner of Red Controll Room Roof and wait and listen for terrorist. This position is particularly vulnerable and will be depending on Blue Sewer Guy for information.

        The Box Guy
        Armed with: M4.

        Similar to Plan A, The Box Guy will be now supporting Red Room Guy

        Red Roof Guy
        Armed with M4.

        Similar to Plan A, Red Roof Guy is focused on any attempt to breach the Catwalks.
        Last edited by What Is Schwa?; 01-16-2007, 05:51 PM.

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Schwa's Guide: de_Penstock. Defense.

          Plan C

          "Typical Pub Coverage"

          This is coverage I typically see, and is a pretty good plan. The Blue Control Room is heavily guarded and thus the middle room defense is pretty evenly balanced.

          Positions
          At the begining of the round the leader is to announce the plan and assign these roles, or allow players to nominate themselves. For clarity, players should TYPE THEIR POSITION in teamchat after being assigned, so all players have a rough guide as to where the other is. This is helpful if players die without being able to radio enemy positions.

          Blue Room Guy
          Armed with: M4.

          Player should hold in Blue Control Room and watch the area with the exploding barrels. Upon loss of health Blue Room Guy should fall back to Locker Rooms.

          Pipe Room Guy (I forgot to provide a label or image for this position)
          Armed with: M4, Shotty.

          Pipe Room Guy is to assist Blue Room Guy and fallback to Locker Rooms if necessary.

          Catwalk Stairs Guy
          Armed with: Scout, M4, Bullpup.

          This position is to keep an eye on terrorists attempting to breach Catwalks. This player should be in constant communication with Red Roof Guy

          Red Roof Guy
          Armed with: M4

          Same as previous plans.

          Box Guy
          Armed with: M4.

          Same as previous plans.

          Sewer Guy
          Armed with: M4, Shotty.

          Same as previous plans.

          -------

          Special thanks to: Root. For correcting my many typos.
          Last edited by What Is Schwa?; 01-16-2007, 06:40 PM.

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Schwa's Guide: de_Penstock. Defense.

            Very Very Nice, and in good detail
            http://cpargermer.com/wateva/Itchyy1.png

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Schwa's Guide: de_Penstock. Defense.

              Originally posted by What Is Schwa? View Post
              Sewer Guy will often find himself round after round doing very little. For this reason, the weakest member of the squad should be assigned to this position. The primary function here is to let the T's know that every round the sewer route will be guarded. Often times, the T's will try to sneak a player up the sewers in hopes of getting behind the Catwalk defenders, or as a quick way to Bomsite A.
              This is good. Also bear in mind that the sewer guy can be the pivotal player. Not only can he deter a sewer attack, he's in position to move quickly to cats and let an HE fly in whatever direction you tell him the T's are in. He can also move to slow down the T's if they make it through control room and try for A.
              BFCL TF2 league admin

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Schwa's Guide: de_Penstock. Defense.

                Thanks for posting these Schwa!
                ~~ Veritas simplex oratio est ~~
                No matter how far a wizard goes, he will always come back for his hat. --T. Pratchett

                <---- You know you're getting old when you rely on your forum meta-data to remind you how old you are.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Schwa's Guide: de_Penstock. Defense.

                  Well, I just tried it a couple of hours ago, but it was only 2 on 3. Plan A (modified ofcourse) worked really nicely a couple of times, but once they catch on, it's time to switch plans. It'd be good to memorize all of these. It is true that while on top of the red room, it is a good vantage point and you can pick off people crossing on the other side. Having someone in the gas station was really smart too. Good work Schwa.
                  "Common sense is not so common." -Voltaire

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Schwa's Guide: de_Penstock. Defense.

                    Originally posted by War.mongeR1 View Post
                    Well, I just tried it a couple of hours ago, but it was only 2 on 3. Plan A (modified ofcourse) worked really nicely a couple of times
                    Would you care to share your modifications? It's great having set plays for a full team, but the server isn't always full. I find that smaller games tend to bring out some players true tactical potential, and it would be nice to have those players equipped with plans that they can implement.
                    BFCL TF2 league admin

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Schwa's Guide: de_Penstock. Defense.

                      Water attacks are some of the best attacks on this map. 1 defender will not kill more than 2 T's and then the T's have a clear run to A. my opinion. Well done Schwa




                      All I ask for is communication

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Schwa's Guide: de_Penstock. Defense.

                        Originally posted by Ben View Post
                        Water attacks are some of the best attacks on this map. 1 defender will not kill more than 2 T's and then the T's have a clear run to A. my opinion. Well done Schwa
                        Umm... I've seen a lone CT defender take down the entire T team on multiple occasions. I've been the CT defender that has taken down the entire T team on multiple occasions. If the CT in the steam room is doing his job correctly, the Ts have almost no chance of getting through. When I have the bomb on Ts, I never go sewers unless I know that there hasn't been a CT in the steam room.

                        I agree with schwa, when he said that there are two good ways to win on Penstock. I have used the wait and pick before, but my favorite strategy is the red/blue split. If both teams are moving slowly through the control rooms, and there is at least one marksman on the blue side (whose job is to target the catwalks and the roof), the Ts will probably be successful. The bomb can go either way in the red/blue split. If the bomb goes on the red side, then you are obviously planting at B. If the bomb goes blue, you have more options, but I have seen an up till that point successful pincer fail in the locker room before.
                        - Drake_Anra

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Schwa's Guide: de_Penstock. Defense.

                          In order for the CT guarding sewers to take down the T team and stop this rush he really needs to be looking into the entrence, you can get back enough to see the full area, be hard to see, and you can spot Ts before they can spot you, move back just a touch and avoid being flashed meanwhile flashing in. Its a fairly easy spot to guard. The CTs that get overran are the ones that sit on the pipes and actualy let them come into the room.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: Schwa's Guide: de_Penstock. Defense.

                            After reading some of these posts and playing on this map a few times since i find that the sewer guy should not be as you put it 'the weakest member of the team' infact i would be inclined to say the oposite, that it's to much of a great position to waste. Even though it can be tempting to sit on top with your machine gun and wait for them with 100 bullets, its not always the best plan. I believe that the sewer guy should be armed with as many flashes as possible and have a mid to long range gun (aug) and prepared to be on the fly very quickly.

                            It is great to have that extra man whos able to be in a matter of mouse movements over seeing the rear bombsite and also be able to relieve pressure to the ct's on cats with some flashes from your end (to confuse and deterr).

                            Another great thing about having a good shooter at sewers means that you can cut down on your need for that many ct's at the rear bomb site.

                            I very much like your plan b however, but you really need every member of your team to keep in communication and not to take a shot unless they are sure they will stay hidden or unless there is a rush that will overwelm a bomb site.



                            "A pessimist sees the difficulty in every opportunity; an optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty."
                            Winston Churchill

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: Schwa's Guide: de_Penstock. Defense.

                              I often find the terrorist team is far too timid against the sewer rush. There is usually one, maybe two tops, CT's guarding the exit. If they get pushed through, the T's are sitting on the bombsite in less than five seconds and their catwalk and redroom security is smacked from behind. Never underestimate the sewer, it just takes a selfless team that's willing to give it their all to get through the ladder chokepoint.
                              -Zephyr
                              You were once like the newbie who needed a hand from above and TacticalGamer gave you it.

                              You owe the newbie who comes after you that same outstretched hand from above on your honor as a Tactical Gamer.

                              Tactics at TG come from trust and friendship, not meticulous detail and rigid discipline.

                              Everyone should be assumed mature until proven otherwise.

                              We are no clan.
                              We are not a single game.
                              We are mature, intelligent, and cooperative individuals.
                              We are TacticalGamer, a community above and beyond its name.

                              Comment

                              Connect

                              Collapse

                              TeamSpeak 3 Server

                              Collapse

                              Advertisement

                              Collapse

                              Twitter Feed

                              Collapse

                              Working...
                              X